INSIDE THE MARVEL UNIVERSE ROLEPLAYING GAME

[Eric J. Moreels]

<a href="http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/images/previews/0503/RPG_cover.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/images/previews/0503/RPG_covert.jpg" align=left alt="Marvel Universe Roleplaying Game Guide HC preview"></a>Marvel Comics are set to venture into the realm of roleplaying games again this May with the release of the Marvel Universe Roleplaying Game. Designed by Q.E.D. Games, creators of Blue vs Gray: The Civil War Card Game, the MURPG will debut with a 128-page hardcover "bible" of the game's rules, initial character profiles, and more.

Here's how Marvel recently solicited the game in the Previews retailer catalog:

MARVEL UNIVERSE ROLEPLAYING GAME GUIDE HARDCOVER
Cover by Mark Bagley
Spider-Man, the X-Men, Daredevil, Elektra and the rest of the Marvel Universe come to life in this revolutionary new role-playing game from Marvel Comics. Easier and more accessible than any RPG before, the Marvel Universe Role-Playing Game lets you play over 40 of your favorite super heroes and super-villains or create new heroes and villains of your own. This guide contains everything you need to learn and play, including full game system rules, character profiles, briefings and background for the Marvel Universe, pull-out Character Action Display, and a beginning adventure complete with maps.
128 pgs./FC/Marvel PG.....$24.99

Q.E.D. President Jeffrey Simons recently told X-Fan that the new game system will be a radical departure from Marvel's previous RPG products, the Marvel Super Heroes Roleplaying Game in 1984 and the Marvel Super-Heroes Adventure Game in 1998.

<a href="http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/images/games/mshrpg.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/images/games/mshrpgt.jpg" align=right alt="Marvel Super-Heroes Adventure Game"></a>"When we first proposed doing a roleplaying game for Marvel, we were surprised at how quickly they jumped at it," Simons said. "And then we were surprised again when it turned out they had no idea what a roleplaying game was, or how you would play. So we sat down and {designer} Dan Gelber ran a little spontaneous session. So there were {Marvel Comics President & COO} Bill Jemas, {Marvel Comics Managing Editor} David Bogart and a few other Marvel honchos pretending to be superheroes. I think a lot of innocent bystanders got killed, there were bullets and lightning bolts flying around everywhere, but Marvel was hooked. From that moment on, we've never looked back. We've gotten tremendous support from Marvel, especially when it counted, from {Editor-in-Chief} Joe Quesada, Bill and David. When Mark Beazley became our editor, we were overjoyed. He was actually a roleplayer, and he became our strongest champion at Marvel and one of the regular players in Dan's campaign."

"The amazing thing to me is that so many of the other Marvel roleplaying games in the past missed the most important thing about Marvel: it's a comic book. Comic book superheroes don't have a 68% chance of succeeding at what they do. Spider-Man doesn't roll the dice every time he swings from one building to the next. In a comic book, it's not about how good you are, it's about how hard you try. Super heroes are always doing the impossible. So if we were going to make a game that captured the flavor of the Marvel Universe, we needed to make a game where our players could do the impossible regularly. Also, in the comic books, combat happens in a panel or two, at most a couple of pages, then it's on to the next scene. What comic book fan wants to play a game where a 5 minute combat in real life takes over an hour to play in the game? MURPG is a quick game. Basic missions can be played in a couple of hours. Our 3-Mission Issues, one of which comes with each game guide or supplement, are considerably longer, and can easily turn into ongoing campaigns."

Simons explained to X-Fan that the MURPG will utilize plastic counters, known as 'stones', instead of the traditional Dungeons & Dragons d20-esque method of using dice to determine outcomes.

"MURPG is unlike any other roleplaying game, even other diceless ones. The entire game is built around the premise that effort, not probability, should determine outcome. So basically, players put in stones of energy to overcome the stones of resistance of a problem, like catching a falling bus or defusing a bomb. If they put in enough stones, they succeed. If they don't try hard enough, they fail. And just like in life, nobody except the {GamesMaster} is ever sure how hard enough is. That's the basic game mechanic. Heck, it's really the only game mechanic. (We do have a chart to go with it. It compares and contrasts the Difficulties and Resistances of a wide range of activities, relating stones to the real world. It's our only real chart, although there's a table of situational modifiers.) There are two kinds of stones, white stones for health and red stones for energy. You use red stones to do things, and you lose white stones if you're injured. The basic unit of time in our game is a Panel, which is defined as anything an artist can draw and a writer can write in a single panel in a comic book. At the end of a Panel, characters regenerate some of the red stones they used that panel, according to how many white stones of health they have left."

"All of the information a player needs to play is contained on their Character Action Display, which also contains Action Boxes and the Energy Reserve where they keep their stones," continued Simons. "If you want to know what you can do, just look at the Actions on your CAD. It's sort of like a multiple choice test. Pick an Action, put in some stones, describe what you want to do to the GM. MURPG is so easy, two players can get together for what we call 'Brawling' and they don't even need a GM to do it. Each player picks a character, sets out their CAD, and takes their turn at answering the age old questions like, 'Who's a better fighter, Spider-Man or Wolverine?' or 'Who's stronger, Hulk or Thor?'"

Designer Dan Gelber told X-Fan that he creates games that he wants to both play in and run as a GM, something that factored heavily into his work on the MURPG.

"I once saw a gap in RPGs. I wanted a simple but deadly game where the players would wipe each other out without slowing play and enjoy the feeling of mistrust this caused," said Gelber. "So I designed Paranoia to fill that gap, got together with some friends, and twenty years later it wins an award at GAMA! It was a fun game to do. Which brings us to the present. I wanted to run a superhero game. I looked, and every game I saw had so many numbers that I began to feel like an accountant. I needed a game that had fewer numbers and a simple system with less math. More story, less luck. A hero should never have to depend on a die roll. How heroic is that? I wanted a game where story mattered as much as the numbers. A game that was like the comic books. I also wanted a game where you could be a powerful character all at once, without having to play for years, yet where advancement was based on what your character does rather than on random points. But all the games I found had too many numbers, too many charts, and most of them were so rigid that you either had to do an hour's worth of math to do something or found that you could not create the character you wanted unless you played a hundred sessions, just to build up your character to where you thought it should start! The MURPG is just what I wanted. It's fun to run! I have not felt this good about a game since I worked on Paranoia."

"When you create a character in MURPG, you are not trying to break the system, or create the most powerful being ever," Gelber continued. "You are trying to match a vision of your hero to the game system so you can play the character in the Marvel Universe. We constantly tell players that if the Action you want is not there, make it up! Adapt a power and make it your own. It really bothered me when I wanted my character to have, say, a special weapon that was less powerful than a power, but the rules would not allow it. In this system, everything is stones. Count your stones, compare yours to a foe, {get a} result. The description is up to the players. You can say your attack is a force beam, or a battle-axe. Stones are stones. We give different values for each Action during character creation and these have different costs, but that's it. After you create your character, it is just the stones. Darned little math. With the pertinent rules written in on your character sheet, there is no need to constantly refer back to the Game Guide, and with broad Actions there is room for people to provide the descriptions of their characters' Actions and a system for rewarding it. And the wide range of Actions is balanced by allowing players to get disadvantages to offset more powerful creations. We encourage the GM to be generous allowing players to meet their needs."

"The Marvel Universe is a wonderful, fast, free flowing mix it up, and this was not being presented in any of the available RPGs on the subject. Too many numbers, too many restrictions! The idea behind the game is to allow the players to play in the Marvel Universe. To play whatever they want. It is up the GM and the players to create the story between them. It is a joint project, a community story, not a 'game' at all in the normal sense of Chess, or a wargame."

Designer Evan Jones told X-Fan that whilst most Marvel characters will be presented in their most recent incarnation, they will eventually issue supplements devoted entirely to showing alternate variations of certain characters, including name and costume changes.

"First of all, I want to make it clear that we are presenting Marvel characters at what we feel is either their 'most representative' stage of their careers or their most recent incarnation (we used our judgment)," explained Jones. "Jeff likes to call it, 'Their best vision of themselves.' Somewhere down the road, we will be issuing a supplement devoted entirely to character variations, including different teams they served on, different names they went under, different costumes they wore, equipment they used to have (or have newly acquired) and different powers they had, etc. For example, we will provide Hank Pym as Goliath, Doctor Pym, Giant-Man, Yellowjacket, and whatever other variations we dig out of our memories and materials. We gave Hulk in his standard form in the guide, but we'll also eventually be providing him in gray-but-smart, green-but-smart, and future Maestro. You may also find six-armed Spidey, no-Adamantium Wolverine, Archangel-as-Death, Caliban before he met up with Apocalypse, lots of Thors and more. We'll look at Exiles, alternates, what have you, as well. Maybe some individual Sentinels in their (roughly) eight incarnations. Or even a few of the heroes we had occasion to pass over. We may even include alternative interpretations of some of the heroes we have already done, selected from those sent in by players. We'll also probably have a supplement devoted to alternate timelines, other dimensions, parallel universes, etc."

"Which brings me to my second point," Jones continued. "What we are trying to do is provide a great ready-to-eat 'meal' that players can start off with fairly quickly. We are also trying to provide prime 'ingredients' and a great set of 'recipes'. But we are also trying to explain how to 'cook' by taking part of one power, combining it with part of another, and creating a new power entirely. And we are trying to show how a GM (and even the players) can make up one's own recipes from scratch. Because I don't want everyone using just the powers we provide. I want GMs adding to the list, and slicing and dicing it to get whatever they can't get from it directly. We'll include the best of those, too, in future supplements. Of course, we'll be adding to the list, too - by adding new powers each supplement to go along with the many new hero profiles we'll include in each supplement."

"In other words, it's a big universe out there. Give us time and we'll get to it. But I know there are going to be people out there who look at the game guide and the first thing they're going to say is, 'How could you leave out Iceman?' So keep in mind, we've already started working on the Spidey's NY supplement, which is number 3, after the X-Men supplement, and the Avengers Supplement. We'll get to everyone, eventually. All GMs, and therefore, all 'Universes' are different. And when a GM manages to get his Universe to balance, that balance will be a very individual kind of thing. The GM should not hesitate to make up new super powers and 'fix the price' to suit the needs of the campaign and may want to bump the purchase price up or down as he sees fit. In short, new recipes for the ingredients, new ways to use the ingredients on their own."

"If the original Dungeons & Dragons first came out today, would anyone take the time to learn how to play it, let alone if it took two books and over 700 pages to learn how to play?" Simons asked rhetorically. "We looked at collectible card games and computer roleplaying games and figure out what gamers are looking for today. When we put it all in the blender along with a couple of old issues of Spider-Man and Uncanny X-Men (rare, expensive and quite tasty), what came out was this totally unique, easy-to-play roleplaying game. And then something cool started happening. Everyone who played the game loved it. Even people who didn't want to love it. People who love dice. People who hate comic books. People who had played every RPG made since Chainmail. But I knew we had a winner when my 12 year old niece and my 8 year old nephew were not only able to play the game using existing characters, but wanted to create characters of their own."

The Marvel Universe Roleplaying Game Guide is due to arrive in stores on May 7. This will be followed by a 96-page Guide to The X-Men in July, with a 96-page Guide to The Avengers tentatively scheduled for October.

Look for the world premiere of the Marvel Universe Roleplaying Game with a 72-page pull-out in InQuest Gamer #96, on sale March 5.

[Nightcrawler-0]

Looks interesting. So basically, it's a betting game, where you hve to balance your energy, while hoping your opponent or the events don't outdo you, I guess.

[skankinwolvie]

When I first started reading the article I was skeptical but after finishing it I'm pretty sold on the concept, I especially like how they will make supplements for pretty much everything you could need in this game to be any marvel character.

[Zachary J. Morrison]

Interesting...I'll have to check this out.

[AngelinLeather]

Ill take a look at it after its been out awhile. Get some response from it.

[Wolverine]

Nice cover by Mark Bagely

[australianreaver]

They left out Iceman?? :p

[TheBoz1678]

I like this stone idea. For too long TSR and now Wizards of the coast of subjugated us all with their hundreds and hundreds of dice and rules. I like this game for it's simplicity and hopefully it will be cost effective, for me anyway :D

[Alex Guillen]

well it looks interesting on paper at least, I'd have to play it to really give it a fair rating but it does sound interesting.

[Refleshed]

I'm sure gonna check this out as soon as I know someone who has it... I don't think I'm gonna buy it myself though, I'm saving my money for the comics!

[W. Molstad]

Well, just got used to Heroclix. Love that game enough. I liked the old complicated Marvel Game RPG. I played it when I was like 10, so it was easy enough for me to understand. But Heroclix rocks on it. This though would be nice for those looking to create stories I guess, if it is really what it says it is.
:bow:

[wickedtrybe]

Even from a non Marval (Gasp, gasp) stand point, this idea is amazing.

The Live Action Gaming community have been looking for something better than Rock Papper Scissors to run games in, and with the advent of this 'Potential' system, I'm sure great things are on the forefront, even if it's not Marvel based.

Not to mention how cool it will be to play in a diceless role playing game where skill and strategy rules. :D

Sweet...

Wickedtrybe

[vayman]

I'm still running a Marvel SAGA rules campaign. The rules are simple; not too wide open. My players and I are able to concentrate on storytelling and roleplaying rather then numbers crunching and rules mongering.

Still, we will check out the new system when it comes out. At the very least I will use the material within the new supplements to convert them to SAGA rules. At the very best, we will like the new system and convert our campaign over to it.

Either way, I and my players at www.vayworld.com will strongly support any Marvel Roleplaying game system!

Excelsior!

[Evan Jones]

Hullo, I'm Evan Jones from Q.E.D.. I'll be around to answer any questions you have.

[Blake Hutchins]

Hello Evan,

Release date?

Best,

Blake

[Evan Jones]

May 7, for the initial Game Guide. The Inquest version has been released (a limited version without such things as Intelligence-based characters and character creation). There have been a couple of sample pages released in Inquest since then, as well.

Did anyone get a look at any of that?

And don't hesitate to shower me with the usual questions and demands for justification! I can't promise you'll wind up agreeing, but I'll at least tell you how we "got there".

[Evan Jones]

And yes, Iceman is in the Supplement!

If anyone has questions about play mechanics or why we rated so-and-so such-and-such, I'll be happy to give you our reasoning. And if you want to bounce house rules off me, that's fine, too. I may be able to give you a heads up so as to avoid rules snags.

[Evan Jones]

They tell me that release date has been a bit delayed. The main Game Guide should be out a few days before the end of the month.

[Baron]

Just wondering why Captain America is given an intelligence of 2 while Wolverine is given a 4?

[CannonballFan]

No dice....dislike change....rules sound good....must buy!!!

All in all it sounds pretty cool. It falls into my 'Under $30" rule, so I'll pick it up and see how it goes. I am a HUGE MnM Fan, but there's always room for one more Supers RPG and it is Marvel after all.

[Evan Jones]

That's actually how Marvel rated them. (We have to take into account such factors as Wolverine's many languages.) We give Cap enough extra Mental Defense to be every bit as strong-willed as W., however, and he has good Leadership, as well.

However, if you want, you could make them both 3 and it wouldn't make an awful lot of difference.

[CannonballFan]

Any update on a release date??

[Evan Jones]

They're telling me before Memorial Day. I heard the 21st bruted about, but I don't know if that actually meant anything. The X-Man Supplement is supposedly set to go on June 4th. Avengers in September!

[WYLDKARDE]

Why did they put Spidey in the 2-5 ton range (STRENGTH OF 5)when like FOREVER in all the Marvel Universes they have placed him in the 10 ton range? (STRENGTH OF 6)
I can only see this IF we are taling the Ultimate version of Spiderman, since he is way younger in that series.
Also, isn't Thor a little "thin skinned" so to speak? (Toughness of 2)I haven't played the game yet, but it seems that as far as taking damage, he is not as tough as I figured he would be. I know he doesn't have the Hulk's, Thing's or Wonderman's hide, but I thought he would have slightly higher defenses than that.

Also for the Avengers Sourcebook, tell them to NOT FORGET TO PUT COUNT NEFERIA IN THERE!!!
Thanks for your time. :)

[Evan Jones]

We basically went with what Marvel wanted us to. But the numbers could be adjusted without harming the way he is played.

While you're at it you might want to consider scaling his Intel down a point or two and making his web-shooters a modifier (as in the movie) rather than equipment.

All Asgardians get some natural Toughness (which is quite "expensive"), but they're by no means invulnerable. They do get very high physical Abilities, though.

But one thing we've discovered is that the readers and creators often have differing views of the same characters. Even though they are viewing the exact same end product. Creators live in the future and revel quirks and contradictions. The readers take more of a standard Historical perspective and tend to smoothe out (or codify, compartmentalize) contradictions. We have been conforming to the writer's perspective in this but are totally sympathetic to the other view (and encourage you to make any changes you deem fit).

We may even work it out so selected "missing" profiles and alternate interpretations of characters can get posted on the Marvel site. (In the X-Man sup. we do Dazzler as an "Absorption/Redirection type, but that's no reason she couldn't have been done up as a sort of "Mastery of Light and Sound").

[WYLDKARDE]

Yeah, I hear you. You guys are just following their instructions, but I can tell I'll be doing some tinkering already.
As I said in the case of Spidey, every incarnation of "The Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe" (TOHOTMU for short) that has ever been made consistantly puts Spidey in the 10 ton range. I can only imagine a brain fart from Marvel to change it now.
As for Thor, I know hes not invulnerable, but TOHOTMU has his Durability listed as "Metahuman" and his Stamina listed as "Godlike', so I myself might just up his Toughness to 3, but for sure I'm putting his durability to Metahuman
As a side note, it seems that for the game that Durability is a combo of the stats Durability and Stamina just as Agility is a combo of Agility and Reflexes from TOHOTMU, the other stats are pretty much the same (i.e. Strength is Strength, Speed is Speed, Intelligence is Intelligence) and translate perfectly.
Having the last incarnation of TOHOTMU will be a good tool for this game, I wonder if Marvel would ever consider starting that series up again? hmmm....
For thoses who don't have the TOHOTMU,especially the last version made, where a Hero's stats match those of this game (i.e Strentgh:Metahuman, etc) RAID YOUR COMIC STORE! Seriously, it will be a great companion to this game.

Regardless, I am REALLY looking forward to this game.:)

[WYLDKARDE]

Heres another question for you.

I was wondering if there was any word on either cardboard, lead or plastic minis? I guess one could use the Heroclicks minis (provided one recieves the ones they need since its a random collectable series for their game. If you only want them for minis for this new Marvel Universe game, it can get VERY spendy VERY fast before you have the all characters you need, and you may still not get certain characters you want. A released set (cardboard/plastic/lead) of like "The Avengers", "The Fantastic Four" or "Spider-man's Rogue gallery #3", "Squad of Hydra Agents" for example would be AWESOME in some form.

Again thanks for your time.

[Evan Jones]

Heroclix will do just fine for them, if you can get what you want, that is. (But if the game sells maybe a few hundred thousand copies, anything is possible! Or so the Gods say . . .)

[Evan Jones]

Originally posted by WYLDKARDE
Yeah, I hear you. You guys are just following their instructions, but I can tell I'll be doing some tinkering already.
As I said in the case of Spidey, every incarnation of &quot;The Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe&quot; (TOHOTMU for short) that has ever been made consistantly puts Spidey in the 10 ton range. I can only imagine a brain fart from Marvel to change it now.
As for Thor, I know hes not invulnerable, but TOHOTMU has his Durability listed as &quot;Metahuman&quot; and his Stamina listed as &quot;Godlike', so I myself might just up his Toughness to 3, but for sure I'm putting his durability to Metahuman
As a side note, it seems that for the game that Durability is a combo of the stats Durability and Stamina just as Agility is a combo of Agility and Reflexes from TOHOTMU, the other stats are pretty much the same (i.e. Strength is Strength, Speed is Speed, Intelligence is Intelligence) and translate perfectly.
Having the last incarnation of TOHOTMU will be a good tool for this game, I wonder if Marvel would ever consider starting that series up again? hmmm....
For thoses who don't have the TOHOTMU,especially the last version made, where a Hero's stats match those of this game (i.e Strentgh:Metahuman, etc) RAID YOUR COMIC STORE! Seriously, it will be a great companion to this game.

Regardless, I am REALLY looking forward to this game.:)


Actually, I just rechecked, and Mr. T.'s Durability is 6 and his Toughness is a whopping +6. I think we changed that at the last minute, so the pre-released sample may be off!

We also take Toughness into account when we are figuring Durability.

We managed to get ahold (after a great deal of time and trouble), the Official handbooks (deluxe edition), the 1989 updates (missing vol 5) and the complete expanded Book of the Dead. We also have an impressive set of the "3-holers", which are thinner on story but have excellent citations. Of course, all that data is as old as Moses' toes and twice as corny, but we find it immeasurably (what's that, a 9?) useful in our ongoing endeavors.

[WYLDKARDE]

Originally posted by Evan Jones
Heroclix will do just fine for them, if you can get what you want, that is. (But if the game sells maybe a few hundred thousand copies, anything is possible! Or so the Gods say . . .)

I'm hoping it sells well, cause like I said, Heroclicks are just too damn expensive for me. I did collect them for a bit, but I got to a point where although I don't have then all, I could buy like 7 boxes and still get all doubles. To get some characters seperate costs an arm and a leg. I would love for them to sell them as sets instead of the random box deal they have going, but I guess the random deal is what most people like.

[WYLDKARDE]

OK, I have yet ANOTHER question for you. :D

How would lets say, Professor X (in his crippled/wheelchair using state) be listed for agility, since you don't have below average stats (except Intelligence)? He would not be a "1" (average)
Can characters have "0" for a stat?

[CannonballFan]

Well, I couldn't find the Inquest but I did print out the few pages from Marvel.com. Granted, it's not real easy to decipher much about the game from that, but it still looks fairly cool. I am getting pretty excited to take a look at the game when it shows up.

"How would lets say, Professor X (in his crippled/wheelchair using state) be listed for agility, since you don't have below average stats (except Intelligence)? He would not be a "1" (average) Can characters have "0" for a stat?"

Granted, I don't know a darn thing about the game but I do know about people in wheelchairs. Despite the lack of mobility in the legs, many wheelchair-bound people(those in manual chairs) are VERY agile. I am not sure how movement works in the game, but a decreased movement would be more appropriate than decreased Agility.

[WYLDKARDE]

My question is can you have a "0" stat for below average abilities like strength, agility, speed or durability. Aunt May should not have average strength, agility durability or speed. How do you make that? Lets say I have a elderly character who is physically like Aunt may, but she has all kinds of funky mental powers? (ala Madam Web) How do I stat that?

As for folks in wheelchairs and their agility, I see what your saying but still, if Prof X fell out of his chair and some badguy like Black Tom or Juggernaunt was gonna hit him, unless Prof X can use his mental powers, he is gonna get hit with barely any problem at all. I would think that Prox X's chair might give him a "average" movement, and he might even be more agile then he would would seem, (due to increased arm strength, etc) but I'm sorry, he still would not be average. I have worked in the medical field for over ten years, I have seen some truly amazing things and yes, once in a while, you see someone really gifted who performs more advanced than one would guess, but this is the unique, not the norm. In the comics, Prof X has never displayed that kind of ability outside the chair (while he was in his crippled state) And I can imagine Prof X having average strength wheeling himself around (before they gave him the automated chair, I'm talking the "old school" Prof X), but his agility could not and should not be considered "average".

[Evan Jones]

As for zeros in Abilities--well, I hear you--but I lost that argument. They DID let me get away with it for intelligence . . . #p^1

How we wind up handling it is that you get a 1 and a note on your CAD (usually under Modifiers). So it's like a 1, but wirh restrictions.

In our X-Man Adventure in the X-man Supplement we have a somewhat similar. (And of course, Prof. X.)

P.S., just because WE don't give out zeros (as per "company policy") sure as heck doesn't mean YOU cant! But the game works without it.

[WYLDKARDE]

Thanks for your responses man.:)
Well, I'm hoping the game comes out soon, I REALLY want to see that Avengers supplement.

[CannonballFan]

Originally posted by WYLDKARDE

Well, I'm hoping the game comes out soon, I REALLY want to see that Avengers supplement.

I'm with you! I read somewhere that it's out on 5/28/2003...so one more week. IF reports are correct that is. There are some good deals on it out there if you look.

[Evan Jones]

It's in the stores now! It went on sale as of yesterday.

Buy early and often!

[CannonballFan]

Very cool!! Thanks Evan. Now I can go buy the book and come here to bug you with all of the questions that I have.:p So, will I be able to pick this up at the Barnes and Nobel or will I need to go to my FLGS??

[WYLDKARDE]

There is this comic/gaming store "The Source" near where I live, I'll give 'em a call and see if its in there.

[CannonballFan]

One more question before I rush out an buy this thing. Is there anything in the works as far as an official/unofficial website or anything?? I know that there is a very little bit of stuff at Marvel.com, but they don't have message baords or anything. A website would be great.

Thanks

[WYLDKARDE]

They told me next week.:mad:

[WYLDKARDE]

oh well.
Note to Marvel, I do think that you guys did drop the ball by not allowing below average stats (i.e. start 1 as "poor", 2 as "normal..etc or even "0" as below average) BUT I am gonna get this game.

[Evan Jones]

FWIW, we had quite a discussion about it. It was eventually decided that you had to be able to about at least 1 stone into Ability attempts and that the effects of that stone would be considered in light of a "disability" noted under Modifiers.

Some GMs will probably tweak their D&Rs a bit (which is inevitable in any case), and we encourage all such "settling in".

[CannonballFan]

I got it on Thursday or Friday of last week. I am still plowing through it...I had a loooooong weekend and didn't get a lot of 'me' time. It looks pretty good so far, I am about half way through Character Creation...and that is usually the 'tell-tale' of most games.

I agree with WK in that there should be a way to represent a below average stat. I understand that there are Sit Mods, but having it built right into the character would have been easier.

[Cwylric]

Originally posted by Evan Jones
Hullo, I'm Evan Jones from Q.E.D.. I'll be around to answer any questions you have.

Hi! I originally sent this to Marvel, but, a few minutes later, I came across your note, here, and figured that any replies might be of interest to other readers, as well.

Anyway, I recently picked up your new Marvel Universe RPG, and it has become the "hot topic" with my gaming crew. In general, we really like it, and we are all impressed with the elegance of the system. We did have a few problems and questions, however, most of which came up while we were creating characters for our first campaign:

1) Energy Absorption/Reflection: The description of this Action is really vague and has left us with a few questions. I mean, the basic function seems obvious enough: you soak up red stones of damage, up to twice your Action Number, and put them in your Energy Reserve. However, the devils (and there are many) are in the details:

- "You may absorb up to twice your Action Number of red stones of energy and store it in your Energy Reserve for later use or immediately reflect it back." Is the 2 x Action Number limit *in total* or *per panel*? Either interpretation seems viable, when you read the rest of the power's description, but the latter is much tougher. And a related question...

- "Any stones above your limits bleed off at a rate of 1 stone per panel." I'm guessing that by "limits", you mean the character's normal Energy Reserve limit of 3 x Durability, not the limit imposed by 2 x his Absorption Action Number (the regeneration info on page 13 seems to confirm this). But I could easily be wrong -- especially if the absorption limit is in total, rather than per panel, as discussed above. The pluralized form of "limits" makes this anything but certain. One player took this to mean that you bleed off energy in excess of 2 x Action Number, but this doesn't really make much sense if your normal Energy Reserve is higher (which it very often is). Nor does it explain the pluralized "limits". Another option that was suggested was that you would bleed off stones in excess of your normal Reserve limit *plus* your 2 x Action Number limit (which would explain the pluralized "limits" and would seem sensible if the 2 x Action Number restriction was in total and not per panel). To summarize: what, exactly, is meant by "limits", in the above line?

- The confusion arising from the above ambiguities is further compunded by the line "ABSORPTION: Save red stones for later use (up to double normal amount) store in Energy Reserve." What does "up to double normal amount" actually mean? Double your normal Energy Reserve? Double your Action Number? Double your absorption limit (which is already twice your Action Number, and so would be your Action Number quadrupled)?

- An observation, related to the above question: In Marvel, some absorbers who exceed their limits don't just have to worry about "bleed off". More often, they also have to worry about rather more... uhm... explosive consequences. I suppose this could be taken as some sort of Disadvantage, but it would be an awfully common one (more like the default situation). Again, just an observation.

- "Energy Damage you suffer can come from your reserve stones." Say what? This seems to imply that you can absorb an energy attack up to twice your Action Number, storing the energy, and then still keep on sucking up energy (without storing it) by giving up one Energy stone per stone of damage. Are we reading this right? If so, then it seems as though a character with even moderate Absorption is pretty much immune to energy attacks. For example, just having an Action Number of 5 would allow you to ignore 20 stones of damage (suck up the first 10, then use the stones you got from that to ignore the last 10) -- and that doesn't even include any of your normal reserve stones that you might be willing to part with. In fact, an absorber with a couple of spare stones and an Action Number of only 4 could completely ignore Cyclops' optic blast, even without defending and even with the blast's x2 damage modifier (soak up 8 energy stones, use the 8 to block 8 more, then toss in 2 of your own, to completely ignore an 18 stones attack). Shudder...

- Finally, the big question: Do stones absorbed simply get added into the character's normal reserve or are they kept separate? The former seems to be implied and would certainly be a lot easier to manage. On the other hand, it would also mean that the absorber can fire off blasts even before he has absorbed any energy. As noted in the last question, it would also mean that he can use his own normal reserve stones to ignore excess damage once he has used up any that he gained from absorption (again, making him almost immune to energy attacks). The latter method -- that is, keeping the two sets of stones separate -- would clear up these problems (well, the first one, anyway) but would be a bit of a pain, from a purely practical point of view (almost requiring a third type of stone). And there is nothing in the power's description to indicate that this a correct interpretation -- unless the 2 x Action Number limit applies to just such an extra pool... Which it might... We just don't know.

- One other observation: The Bishop example in the book does nothing to answer any of these questions. That's something you might want to watch in the future. We noticed that a lot of your examples -- for this and other powers, as well -- were not really very useful because they generally seemed to have the Action working in the most mundane, obvious fashion and, thus, answered only the most mundane, obvious questions. As a rule of thumb, it is better to push the limits, in an example, so that more possible questions are answered. In the Absorption example, having Bishop get blasted by energy in *excess* of his 10 stone limit (rather that a good deal less) might have cleared up some of this confusion, right out of the gate.

And on to other topics...

Leaping: Where is it? It seems like an obvious sort of Action to have. Toad, for example, should have it. I thought that it might have been left out deliberately, since its function can be covered, to a degree, by Acrobatics, but then I noticed the line on page 60: "Toad, for example, has Leaping and Wall Climbing to complement this power." What's up with that? According to his write-up on page 34, he doesn't have Leaping (which doesn't even exist), and he doesn't have Acrobatics, either (which kind of ruins my theory).

Entangle: Again, this seems to be an obvious sort of power to have, but we could find no sign of it. In fact, as one of my players observed, "they fudged on that one for Spider-Man" (referring to the fact that his ability to entangle foes was simply stuck in as a throw-away line, under his web-shooters, with no real explanation). Page 32: "If you get through defense, you web opponent." (huh?) Page 10: "Fluid use = stones used in web shooting/slinging. If you get through defense, you succeed in webbing your opponent." (better, but still very incomplete) What exactly does this mean? Since the web shooters have no Action Number (just a +6 modifier), the implication is that you can use as much web as you want, in a single shot, up to the cannister's limit of 100 stones. I would like to see even Galactus get out of that... Ignoring that problem, for a moment, what exactly happens once a foe has been "webbed up"? How does he get out? Does it last for a set duration, or does he resist with his Strength? If so, is it simply a Difficulty/Resistance thing, or does the web count as an object that must be "broken"? If so, what are its stats? We were hoping to make sense of this, since one player wants a plant-based entangle, which we had originally planned to model on Spider-Man's webs -- until we realized that there were no rules for them or any other entangle. I understand that this is a "rules light" system, but the info for Spidey's web-shooters is vague to the point of being useless... And he is Marvel's flagship character, after all.

Regeneration of Red Stones: This may be a dumb question, but I couldn't find any clear, unambiguous answer in the book. Do you regenerate red energy stones based on your *current* (possibly wounded) white stones or your *normal* (unwounded) white stones? The former makes sense, at first glance, and has dramatic possibilities, but it implies that a character who has been badly wounded does not regenerate energy at all. It also begs the question of which type of stone regenerates first, if you have a Healing Factor.

Phew... guess I got a little long-winded, there. Anyway, thanks in advance for any help and for bringing out such an interesting and, in many ways, innovative game.

Pax!

Cwylric


:dunce: Oops! Never mind that last question about red stone regeneration. I just found my own answer on page 13, i.e. "If a character has no white stones of health, she may not regenerate any red stones of energy." Kind of rough on wounded characters, though... Doesn't that mean that a character is practically comatose even with two red stones of health (after losing the last white one), since she can't put any effort into any actions?

[WYLDKARDE]

Originally posted by CannonballFan
I got it on Thursday or Friday of last week. I am still plowing through it...I had a loooooong weekend and didn't get a lot of 'me' time. It looks pretty good so far, I am about half way through Character Creation...and that is usually the 'tell-tale' of most games.

I agree with WK in that there should be a way to represent a below average stat. I understand that there are Sit Mods, but having it built right into the character would have been easier.

DAMN I envy you man...My comic/gamestore has told me I have to wait AGAIN untill like next week.:mad:

I am really getting iritated, but hell, what can I do?

Also, Is there word on a GM screen? I know we basicly only have 2 charts, but you need to have a screen to hide all your NPC's stones from the PC's.

Also for those who have it, what does the cover look like? I have seen the "spidey" cover and the "assorted marvel characters" cover...which one is it? Just curious since I can't BUY MY OWN YET...:mad:

[Cwylric]

Originally posted by WYLDKARDE


DAMN I envy you man...My comic/gamestore has told me I have to wait AGAIN untill like next week.:mad:

I am really getting iritated, but hell, what can I do?

Find a new game store? ;)

Seriously, if you don't mind going the mail order route, try:
http://www.comic-encounters.com/

They're quick and they get practically everything (including a lot of old stuff you can't find anywhere else). That's where I got my copy last week.

Originally posted by WYLDKARDE
Also for those who have it, what does the cover look like? I have seen the &quot;spidey&quot; cover and the &quot;assorted marvel characters&quot; cover...which one is it? Just curious since I can't BUY MY OWN YET...:mad:

They went with the Spider-Man cover. Jeffery Suter did it, I think.

[WYLDKARDE]

I looked in several comic and game stores here in the Minnesota Twin Cities area, it doesn't seem ANYONE has recieved thier shipments of the new MURPG yet. :mad:
They ALL promise next week.

[WYLDKARDE]

Originally posted by Cwylric

They went with the Spider-Man cover. Jeffery Suter did it, I think.

Thanks for answering my question.:)

Do you think it will be hard for the GM to control a bunch of NPC's with all those stones and all?
As a side note, I really want to recreate the "Avengers versus Count Neferia' so I cant wait for that Avengers source book.:D

[Cwylric]

Originally posted by WYLDKARDE


Do you think it will be hard for the GM to control a bunch of NPC's with all those stones and all?

I was wondering much the same thing, but, since I haven't run a game as a GM, yet, it's too early to tell. The book talks about that a bit on page 100 (you'll see what I mean when you get a copy), but their solution seems only so-so. In a nutshell, you split up a normal CAD to represent three characters, instead of one, using the top box for Health and Defense, the middle one for Energy, and the bottom one for the character's current Action. Not sure what you're supposed to do if a character takes two Actions, instead of one... To be honest, I was beginning to wonder if it might be simpler for the GM to just skip the stones and scribble NPCs Actions on a scrap piece of paper. It would be less elegant but would also take up a lot less room.

We have run into another problem, though, when testing the game with some straight-forward brawls. The resource-style system used seems kind of broken when it comes to characters with persistent powers. Specifically, one player tried using Cyclops and quickly discovered that he doesn't work at all well. As soon as he starts to run out of steam, his Optic Blast effectively turns off (since he has no stones to spend on it). And once he gets wounded, the situation is even worse, since he can no longer regenerate enough energy to use it at any meaningful level. Does this sound at all like Cyclops? As far as I know, his Optic Blast runs pretty much at full power, no matter what condition he is in (short of dead or having his power sucked out by someone like Rogue) -- in fact, that's his main Challenge, really. Most games simply assume that a character like Cyclops has some sort of power modifier that reduces the energy cost of his blast to zero. In MURPG, though, this would be a problem, since it would foul up the way effort is represented with the stones. Much the same problem would probably arise when using any character with persistent powers.

I came up with one possible explanation, but I don't really like it, since a player could poke all sorts of holes in it. If you assume that the stones represent focus, in Cyclop's case, rather than beam strength, then the GM could justifiably rule that the beam still works at full power, when Cyclops is tired or wounded, but that he can't aim it in any useful way (he is too fatigued to focus properly) and, thus, cannot use it in combat. Of course, this would really only be meaningful in he lost his visor (in which case, the beam would still hit things randomly at full strength). I guess that idea kind of works within the context of the game, but it doesn't really model Cyclops at all well.

BTW, if you are reading this, Evan, do you have any comments about it?

Speaking of Evan, I hope he pops in here at some point to answer some of those questions from my first post. The Entangle thing wasn't just an arbitrary point of interest -- it directly affects one of the characters we were planning to use this weekend. I sent the same questions to the MURPG help address (on Marvel's site), back at the beginning of the week, but, so far, I haven't heard anything back from them. Nada. Doesn't bode well for their "customer support", I'm afraid... :( Guess we'll just have to fake it, if we do end up playing.

Originally posted by WYLDKARDE

As a side note, I really want to recreate the "Avengers versus Count Neferia' so I cant wait for that Avengers source book.

That's the Hulk and Avengers sourcebook, now (in that order -- check out the MURPG site). Gee, I wonder why they would want to make that change right about now...? ;)

[Cwylric]

For those who are interested, there is a review of MURPG right <a href="http://www.matantisi.com/ghoul/archives/000009.html#more">here</a>. Before anyone asks, I had nothing to do with it (I just stumbled over it while surfing), but I do especially agree with a couple of his points, i.e.

"From a bit of toying with the system, it's very clear that standard powers (called "Actions") are nice, but powers bought up to what the game calls "Modifiers" are far better. You see, modifiers don't take any energy to use, they just kick in whenever they apply. "

"Shortcomings? Well, the game has a few. The small size of the book (128 pages) requires them to under-detail many of the rules, leading to some very confusing table entries with little or no explanation. Examples are also in short supply; there are plenty of sample characters at nearly 40 (though they aren't given with their point costs, so you can't use them as ready examples of character creation), but far too few clear examples of play."

Bold face is mine. Actually, there are quite a few examples for powers and such, but, as I said in an earlier post, there is a problem that a lot of them demonstrate only obvious things that anyone could have figured out, rather than subtle things that actually warrant closer examination. I think that is probably what the reviewer was getting at. Given that MURPG's authors seem to be considering this to be a good game for newbies, I think this might be a real problem.

Anyway, just thought you all might be interested in the review (the first one I've seen on-line, so far).

[WYLDKARDE]

hey, there are 2 cool yahoo group sites listed below.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/marveluniverseroleplayinggame/?yguid=143437326

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MURPGList/?yguid=143437326

Hey Cwylric, check them out and put your questions in there, Evan Jones seems to go there too.

[Cwylric]

Originally posted by WYLDKARDE
hey, there are 2 cool yahoo group sites listed below.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/marveluniverseroleplayinggame/?yguid=143437326

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MURPGList/?yguid=143437326

Hey Cwylric, check them out and put your questions in there, Evan Jones seems to go there too.

Thanks, I'll check them out when I have more time. I took a quick glance, but, given that there seem to be hundreds of posts there, it may take a while to sort through them all...

[Cwylric]

Well, we did some more playtesting, and Cyclops is definitely broken, even aside from the persistent power problem I mentioned in an earlier post. We decided to pit him against Wolverine in a variety of circumstances, because this seemed like a interesting match-up. In the comics, they are pretty close, in terms of sheer power, although I would say that Wolverine has an edge (due to experience, not to mention regeneration). We expected, again based on the comics, that the fight would be highly dependent on the environment and situation, i.e. Wolverine would tend to win easily, up close, but Cyclops would tend to win at a range (although probably less easily).

Things turned out very differently, in the game. Cyclops lost every single match, so matter what the circumstances, and he did so really badly. In most cases, Wolverine didn't even get scratched. Generally, he would simply concentrate on defense until he got close to Cyke and then nail him. The longest fight was three panels, and most were only one or two. We tried every imaginable combination, too -- even a laughable "psychic Cyke" match, wherein Cyclops was allowed to see what Wolverine was going to do before setting his own stones. He lasted an extra panel in that one... Does this seem right, according to what we have seen in the comics?

A lot of the time, the problem revolved around Cyclops running out of Energy far too quickly, but there were other problems, as well. Afterwards, I took a closer look at Cyke and realized that it would have been pretty astonishing if he had won, given that he is only a 27 stone character. Yup, you read that right: I worked it out, and he is worth only 27 white stones and 2 red stones, after his 3 stone mutant Challenge reduction. A player could make him as a beginning character and have 12 white stones and 1 red stone to spare. And this doesn't even include any other Challenges he might arguably have, e.g. an over-developed sense of responsibility. Compare this to Jean Grey, who is worth around 80 stones (either 77W2R or 83W2R, depending on whether her Mental Defense Modifier is part of her Telepathy or an extra bonus -- I wasn't sure, since they both have a value of +7 and a total of 14, if they are separate, seems kind of high). Again, does this seem right, according to what we have seen in the comics?

I came up with one possible solution: give Cyclops Targeting. He certainly feels like he should have it, given his comic escapades and the fact that he only needs to see someone to hit him. Adding +4 or +5 Targeting would cost him 9 or 12 white stones, at least putting him on par with a beginning character. It would feel more authentic, put him on a more equal footing with the other X-Men, and take the edge off some of the Energy-related problems (although, I think he might still have trouble, there, and would still tend to lose against Wolverine). As it says right in the Modifier description, it would also give him extra stones, now and then, to use on effects (which seems appropriate). Seems kind of obvious when you look at it that way -- almost an oversight on QED's part, really. Odd, considering that Cyke is one of the characters used in the InQuest adventure and, presumably, should have been thoroughly playtested...

We have been experiencing Energy problems with a few other characters, as well, although not nearly so obviously as with Cyke. In general, fights often seem much too short, not because characters get knocked out, per se, but because they run out of juice and can't defend themselves properly. And before anyone says, "well, you just have to use strategy and get your wind back once in a while", be advised that we tried that. It doesn't work very well. The problem is that you have to use Energy to defend or run away or whatever, as well as attack, so a higher Energy character just pummels you while you are trying to catch your breath. The only time this tactic works at all well is when you have a higher Speed and Agility and you run away. Not very heroic...

In short, it often seems to come down to a battle of Energy, no matter what the characters' powers are. As a result, character's with high Durability and/or lots of Modifers seem to win consistently, even when they are matched against characters who should be far superior, according to the comics. And, even in fair matches, the fights tend to seem kind of short and are often anticlimatic.

Anyway, we're going to fool around a bit more with this before I make any more general observations about the system. Maybe the characters we were using were just modelled poorly. Cyke certainly was. The annoying thing is that we really like many of the ideas in the game -- but the core system seems to need some tweaking.

I came up with a couple of tentative solutions to the Energy problem:

One option would be to increase the Durability multiplier for the Energy Reserve from x3 to x4, x5, or even x6. This would give all characters an increase, across the board, with no other changes necessary. Those with a high Durability would still have a big edge, but at least everyone would have more of a chance to exercise their options for more than one or two panels.

Another option would be to add a new Modifier: Power Battery. It would have a cost of around Modifier + 2 Levels, and each level would add 3 red stones to your Energy Reserve (without improving your Energy regeneration rate, Health, or any other Durability-related traits). For example, a character with Durability 3 and Power Battery 2 (total cost: 5W) would have 3 Health and a regeneration rate of 3 stones, as usual, but would have a normal Energy Reserve of 15. This would work especially well for characters like Cyclops. His Optic Blast would still not be persistent, as it should be, but, at least, it would last a while before he started gasping at fumes.

We are not actually going to implement either of these changes until we have fooled around with the system straight "out of the box" some more. We want to play a few real games, using our own characters, rather than simple brawls, using the characters in the book, before doing anything drastic. I want to see whether this problem is really as big as I think it is, before I try to fix it. In the meantime, though, I just thought others who were having similar problems might find these ideas useful.

[CannonballFan]

Wow...great update on your 'takes'. I've been reading through the book and it seems OK. IMO, the text can be a bit confusing to people who HAVE played RPG's before. There are so many new terms and ideas that it's hard to keep track of them all while you're reading through it. It's going to take a few reading before I get it all.

I think the things that you've pointed out are VERY valid and need some looking into. I like the Power Battery idea. If you think about it, characters like Cyke really don't run out of power that quickly. So, there needs to be an adjustment and I think your Power Battery idea works well.

Personally I need to get into the game and start 'reverse engineering' the 42 pre-gens in there to get a better idea for how character creation works. The ARS is VERY simple and I understood it before I even finished the chapter.

Overall it seems like a well thought out game(admittedly to my suprise) and I really like it. I too am excited for the 'Roster books' and I really think that a GM's Screen would be a great addition. Maybe something of the 4-Panel variety. It would be cool to maybe include something that expands on adventure creation or maybe include some Red and White Stones in the package since the GM needs so many.

Oh well, just my thoughts.

CannonballFan

Oh yeah...Mark Bagley did the cover illo. :spidey:

[WYLDKARDE]

FIRST off, still don't have the damn game:mad:
Second, I agree with both Cannnonballfan and Cwylric about Cyclops. (from what I read).
IMO, I believe the the MURPG is gonna suffer from some "first edition jitters", but I think/hope it will smooth itself out.

[CannonballFan]

IMO this is a good game that CAN be great. They need to address some of thier issues, but once they do (via FAQ or Erratta) things WILL get better.

I will say that they need to base their characters on the CURRENT COMIC BOOK standards. It seems that some characters are modeled at an 'Issue 1' standard while others are at thier current power level. It also seems that with some chacacters, those with an X in particular, they based some of the info off of the movies, rather than the comics. This is OK I guess, but the comic book geek in me would rather have the Comic Book version of the characters.

There also needs to be a better Power Creation ruleset. The whole, 'look for a power/powers similar and base them off that' is a little to vague and I am not sure how novice gamers will handle it.

Company support would be great too. A MURPG Message Board would be GREAT. That way if there were questions/issues with the game we wouldn't have to search 5 different places in the hopes that Evan or someone else will see and answer our questions. If Marvel wants this to work they NEED to support their game and the one page 'blurb' at Marvel.com really doesn't cut it. Not to compare companies, but one of the big Supers RPG's out there, Mutants & Masterminds has a lot of support and the creators are VERY hands on with the players via the message boards. I think this is a big part of why their game has been so successful.

I like this game, or what it can be, I'd hate to see it go away.

[Cwylric]

Originally posted by CannonballFan
I think the things that you've pointed out are VERY valid and need some looking into. I like the Power Battery idea. If you think about it, characters like Cyke really don't run out of power that quickly. So, there needs to be an adjustment and I think your Power Battery idea works well.

Yeah, we're leaning more and more in that direction. Either that or just increasing the Energy Reserve multiplier for Durability substantially.

Personally I need to get into the game and start 'reverse engineering' the 42 pre-gens in there to get a better idea for how character creation works..

I've saved you the trouble. See below. :)

Oh yeah...Mark Bagley did the cover illo.

Oops! You're right. Jeffrey Suter just did the general design.

There also needs to be a better Power Creation ruleset. The whole, 'look for a power/powers similar and base them off that' is a little to vague and I am not sure how novice gamers will handle it.

Not well, from what I have been hearing... :no:

Company support would be great too. A MURPG Message Board would be GREAT. That way if there were questions/issues with the game we wouldn't have to search 5 different places in the hopes that Evan or someone else will see and answer our questions. If Marvel wants this to work they NEED to support their game and the one page 'blurb' at Marvel.com really doesn't cut it.

Amen, to that brother!

[Cwylric]

Well, I finally did it...

For the last few days, scads of people on nearly every MURPG forum have been asking, "how much would so-and-so cost to make from scratch?" I finally sat down and figured that out for every single one of the 42 characters listed in the book. This turned out to be a much bigger effort than I had originally anticipated, since some of the character write-ups are a bit vague and/or contain traits and equipment that simply do not exist in the game. Don't try this at home kiddies...

The results sometimes make sense but are often surprising. Loki, Silver Surfer, and Doc Strange being near the top didn't exactly shock me, for example, but Cyclops and Venom being near the bottom certainly did. I'll leave it to you to discover some of the other anomalies.

Anyway, to start with, here is a list of the characters, in order of cost, from most expensive to least:

Loki: 188w
Silver Surfer: 184w
Doctor Strange: 175w(+)
Iron Man: 165w 1r
Mr. Fantastic: 125w 2r
Hulk: 119w 1r
Ultron: 117w
Magneto: 114w 2r
Thor: 108w(+)
Baron Mordo: 104w
Yellowjacket: 94w 1r
Doctor Doom: 90w
Green Goblin: 88w 2r
Kang: 86w(+)
Thing: 85w 2r
Jean Grey: 81w 2r
Rogue: 79w
Wolverine: 74w
Captain America: 68w
Spider-Man: 64w 1r(?)
Abomination: 61w 1r
Gambit: 57w 2r
Beast: 55w 1r
Daredevil: 53w 1r
Sabretooth: 53w
Kingpin: 52w
Human Torch: 51w 1r
Wasp: 49w
Doctor Octopus: 46w 2r
Storm: 45w 2r
Elektra: 45w 1r
Blob: 43w 1r
Toad: 43w 1r
Mystique: 42w 1r
Punisher: 42w
Bullseye: 39w
Black Cat: 38w 2r
Quicksilver: 38w 2r
Venom: 38w 2r(?)
Invisible Woman: 36w
Scarlet Witch: 33w 1r
Cyclops: 24w 2r

This is just the quicky version. Over the next three posts, I will list a more precise breakdown and describe the steps I used to come up with it. I would have put all of this together in one post, but the total amount of text just seemed too large for that.

If you would like a much neater, more legible document, with spiffy charts and the whole bit, contact me. Remember to specify whether you want MS Word .doc or Adobe Acrobat .pdf format. Either way, the file will be zipped, to save time and bandwidth.

To be continued...

[Cwylric]

>>> MARVEL UNIVERSE RPG CHARACTER COSTS <<<
>>> Part 1: Character Cost Breakdown <<<

In all cases, the costs are given in the following order:
Abilities + Actions + Modifiers + Gear - Challenges = Total.

Obviously, this is not the cleanest way to list everything, but there simply isn't any other way to do it, while ensuring compatibility with all of the forums where this will be posted. If you would like a much neater, more legible document, with spiffy charts and the whole bit, contact me. Remember to specify whether you want MS Word .doc or Adobe Acrobat .pdf format. Either way, the file will be zipped, to save time and bandwidth.

Abomination: 28w 1r + 12w + 27w + 0w - 6w = 61w 1r
Baron Mordo: 11w + 91w + 7w + 0w - 5w = 104w
Beast: 18w + 39w + 6w 1r + 0w - 8w = 55w 1r
Black Cat: 7w + 11w 2r + 22w + 0w - 2w = 38w 2r
Blob: 22w 2r + 12w 2r + 15w + 0w - 7w = 43w 1r
Bullseye: 11w + 15w + 19w + 0w - 6w = 39w
Captain America: 11w 2r + 20w + 12w 1r + 26w - 2w = 68w
Cyclops: 6w + 23w 2r + 1w + 0w - 6w = 24w 2r
Daredevil: 9w + 27w + 18w 1r + 3w - 4w = 53w 1r
Doctor Doom: 14w (7w 1r) + 57w (8w) + 12w (6w 2r) + 0w - 7w (-8w) = 90w
Doctor Octopus: 15w + 19w + 4w + 12w 2r - 4w = 46w 2r
Doctor Strange: 12w + 135w + 11w + 20w(+) - 3w = 175w(+)
Elektra: 8w + 35w + 4w 1r + 0w - 2w = 45w 1r
Gambit: 6w 1r + 57w + 1w 1r + 0w - 7w = 57w 2r
Green Goblin: 18w + 34w + 14w + 30w 2r - 8w = 88w 2r
Jean Grey: 10w 1r + 69w 2r + 6w 2r + 0w - 5w = 81w 2r
Hulk: 55w 2r (4w) + 1w 1r (20w 1r) + 50w (0w) + 0w - 12w = 119w 1r
Human Torch: 6w + 44w + 3w 1r + 0w - 2w = 51w 1r
Invisible Woman: 5w 2r + 31w 1r + 1w + 0w - 2w = 36w
Iron Man: 15w (14w 1r) + 58w 1r (48w 2r) + 9w (31w) + 0w - 3w (-8w) = 165w 1r
Kang: 9w 2r (10w 2r) + 38w (19w 2r) + 16w (7w) + 0w(+) - 5w (-10w) = 86w(+)
Kingpin: 14w 1r + 20w 2r + 9w + 13w - 5w = 52w
Loki: 36w + 129w + 26w + 4w - 7w = 188w
Magneto: 21w 2r + 82w 1r + 9w 2r + 7w - 6w = 114w 2r
Mr. Fantastic: 29w 1r + 93 1r + 9w + 0w - 6w = 125w 2r
Mystique: 6w + 43w + 2r + 0w - 7w 1r = 42w 1r
Punisher: 6w 2r + 24w + 7w + 12w - 7w = 42w
Quicksilver: 32w + 6w 1r + 6w 1r + 0w - 6w = 38w 2r
Rogue: 22w + 31 2r + 30w 1r + 0w - 5w = 79w
Sabretooth: 15w + 20 2r + 25w 1r + 0w - 8w = 53w
Scarlet Witch: 5w 2r + 32w 1r + 1r + 0w - 5w = 33w 1r
Silver Surfer: 49w + 98w + 18w + 25w - 6w = 184w
Spider-Man: 22w + 31w 1r + 14w + 4w(?) - 7w = 64w 1r(?)
Storm: 7w + 44w + 2r + 0w - 6w = 45w 2r
Thing: 27w + 44w + 20w 2r + 0w - 6w = 85w 2r
Thor: 35w (3w) + 37w (11w 1r) + 18w (1w 2r) + 7w(+) - 5w = 108w(+)
Toad: 13w + 33w 1r + 5w + 0w - 8w = 43w 1r
Ultron: 13w 2r + 77w 1r + 39w + 0w - 13w = 117w
Venom: 15w 2r + 20w + 9w + 4w(?) - 10w = 38w 2r(?)
Wasp: 11w + 32w + 8w + 0w - 2w = 49w
Wolverine: 15w 2r + 36w + 32w 1r + 0w - 10w = 74w
Yellowjacket: 17w + 75w 2r + 2w + 4w 2r - 5w = 94w 1r

To be continued...

[Cwylric]

>>> MARVEL UNIVERSE RPG CHARACTER COSTS <<<
>>> Part 2: Challenges Included In Character Cost Breakdown <<<

It should be noted that I only included the most unambiguous Challenges, in each case, and was generally quite conservative in giving out extra stones for them. Furthermore, I based these decisions specifically on the characters presented in the book, in their most typical representation (some characters would have more or fewer Challenges at different times during their history). In some cases, I would have added Challenges and/or raised their value a little, in my own campaign; however, I wanted to set this up as a default base-line, usable by everyone and generating as little debate as possible. You should not hesitate to add additional Challenges and/or modify the value of existing ones, if it seems appropriate to do so.

It is also worth noting that I made certain that every character has at least one Challenge, as specified in the rules. Frankly, this required a little hedging in some cases, e.g Black Cat, Invisible Woman, Wasp.

Finally, you will notice that I halved the value of any Challenge that was partially negated by a character's powers, e.g. Daredevil's blindness, Mystique's unusual appearance. I am a firm believer that a disadvantage should be a disadvantage and not just a source of free stones.


Abomination: Appearance (4), Poverty (2)

Baron Mordo: Egomania/Power Lust (3), Hatred of Dr. Strange (2)

Beast: Appearance (4), Farsighted (1), Mutant (3)

Black Cat: Nose for Trouble (2)

Blob: Appearance (2), Greedy Troublemaker (2), Mutant (3)

Bullseye: Hatred of Daredevil (2), Sociopath (4)

Captain America: Honorable Patriot (2)

Cyclops: Mutant (3), Overly-Developed Sense of Responsibility (3)

Daredevil: Blind (2, halved), Strong Sense of Justice (2)

Doctor Doom: Appearance (2), Egomania/Power Lust (3), Hatred of Fantastic Four and, Especially, Reed Richards (2)

Doctor Octopus: Arrogant Intellectual Snob (2), Occasionally Unbalanced (2)

Doctor Strange: Strong Sense of Responsibility as Sorcerer Supreme (3)

Elektra: Loner with Little Trust in Others (2)

Gambit: Appearance (2), Feels Like Outsider (2), Mutant (3)

Green Goblin: Insane (5), Extreme Hatred of Spider-Man (3)

Jean Grey: Compassionate/Empathic (2), Mutant (3)

Hulk: Appearance (4), Disdain of Each Form for the Other (2), Rage (3), Uncontrolled Transformation (3, see below)

Human Torch: Impetuous (2)

Invisible Woman: Protective of Family and Team (2)

Iron Man: Artificial Heart Requires Occasional Recharge (1), Recovered Alcoholic (2)

Kang: Egomania/Power Lust (3), Seeks Worthy Adversaries (2)

Kingpin: Protective of Wife (2), Strongly Competitive (3)

Loki: Desire to Rule Asgard (3), Hatred of Thor (2), Nose for Trouble (2)

Magneto: Mutant (3), Obsessed with Advancing Mutant Cause (3)

Mr. Fantastic: Loses Track of Day-to-Day Affairs (2), Strong Scientific Curiosity (3)

Mystique: Appearance (1, halved), Looks at Normal Humans as Tools or Obstacles (3), Mutant (3)

Punisher: Haunted Past (2), Obsessed with War on Crime (3), Will Not Harm Innocents (2)

Quicksilver: Arrogant, Proud, and Distrustful (3), Mutant (3)

Rogue: Mutant (3), Occasionally Disturbed by Remnants of Absorbed Psyches (2)

Sabretooth: Appearance (2), Bloodlust (3), Mutant (3)

Scarlet Witch: Mutant (3), Weirdness Magnet (2)

Silver Surfer: Appearance (3), Protects Life (2), Restless (1)

Spider-Man: Bad Luck (3), Poverty (2), Strong Sense of Responsibility (3)

Storm: Extreme Claustrophobia (3), Mutant (3)

Thing: Appearance (4), Occasional Bouts of Depression (2)

Thor: Conflicting Interests (3), Honorable (2)

Toad: Amoral and Sometimes Nasty (2), Appearance (3), Mutant (3)

Ultron: Appearance/Lack of Humanity (4), Hatred of Humans (3), Extreme Megalomania (4), Poverty (2).

Venom: Appearance (2, halved), Extreme Hatred of Spider-Man (3), Often Ruthless and Amoral (2), Vulnerable to Fire and Sonics, Taking x2 Damage (3)

Wasp: Weirdness Magnet (2)

Wolverine: Haunted Past (2), Loner (2), Mutant (3), Soft Spot for Jean Grey (1), Temper (2, since his control has improved)

Yellowjacket: Bad Luck (3), Occasional Mental Instability (2)


To be continued...

[Cwylric]

>>> MARVEL UNIVERSE RPG CHARACTER COSTS <<<
>>> Part 3: Design Notes <<<

This section simply gives a brief insight into my decision-making process while working on these characters, e.g. costs of traits not listed in the book, problems associated with the translation of the character, and so forth. Ideally, this should answer some of the questions you may have, when analyzing the values given above. If a character is not listed here, that means that the calculations were completely straightforward and required no special tinkering or evaluation on my part.

General Note: Remember that characters who use Intelligence to provide their energy must pay double for that score. This applies to Baron Mordo, Doctor Octopus, Doctor Strange, Jean Grey, Iron Man (personal energy only), Magneto, Mr. Fantastic, and Wasp.

Beast: The "x2 Natural Healing Rate" Modifier is not listed in the character creation section, but I assume it is worth around 2w. This is based on the idea that it is not as useful as Healing Factor, which would cost 4w (based on a Durability of 4).

Captain America: See the note under Beast about Cap's "x2 Natural Healing Rate" Modifier. I assume that Targeting that only works with a specific weapon has a -2 level Disadvantage, similar to "Out of Control Without Device" or "Weaker Away from Power Source". The cost for Cap's shield is taken straight from page 126.

Daredevil: The cost for DD's suit is taken straight from page 126. His billy club has no cost (at least, in stones). Note that DD can add his billy club Modifier to his Acrobatics (in addition to Agility), but I consider this to be only a +2 level Advantage, since the usual +5 would be absurd for a +4 increase that works only with a specific item, under specific circumstances.

Doctor Doom: The parenthetical values are for his Powered Armor. Note that the total cost for the suit's weapons and Modifiers is reduced by 8w to reflect Doom's Wealth, as usual (this is included, parenthetically, under Challenges).

Doctor Octopus: Doc Ock's tentacles - which are listed under Gear - turned out to be a bit of a headache, since they do not appear to conform to the normal Tongue/Tail/Tendril Whip rules (ironic, given that they are, arguably, the classic example of this power). The ability to have two or more work together to increase his effective Strength is simply an extension of the usual "add +1 to double the effort" rule, so this "perk" is, arguably, a non-ability. On the other hand, the fact that Ock has more than one tentacle, in the first place, is clearly an advantage (even if they do not actually increase his allowable number of Actions). I finally settled on buying the power with a +2 Advantage, bringing its total effective Cost Level to 9 (12w). This is more than a Strength of 7 would have cost him and gives him no cost break for the power being in a device, but then many other advantages are provided, and he is seldom without this particular device, anyway. Ock's Underwater Breathing is less useful than the "No Need to Breathe" aspect of Self-Contained Lifeform (which costs only 1w, by itself), so I charged him only 2r for it. Given that it is in a device, the cost could be reduced even lower, to 1r, but that seemed too generous.

Doctor Strange: Youch! At 175w, he certainly is the Sorcerer Supreme! Anyway, the value of most of his gear is listed on page 126. I priced the Book of Vishanti at 2w, since it adds +1 to his effective Sorcery (worth 5w, in his case) but is a seldom-carried "device" and probably takes time to access. The Books of Lore, Mystical Artifacts, and Sanctum Sanctorum have no effective cost, in stones. Frankly, I have no idea what the value of the Orb of Agamotto would be, since the game has no clairvoyance-type powers and, in any event, the device's Action Number is undefined, so I just left it out of the equation. Obviously, it could easily push his cost over the 180w mark.

Gambit: I calculated Gambit's cost exactly as they built him, but it is, frankly, a very inefficient route to take. Since he can use his Agility Bonus with Charge Objects, this adds +5 to the Cost Level (bringing the total to +15, for 40w); however, since he has an Agility of only 3, this grants him a total effective Action Number of only 9. Had he simply raised his Action Number to 9, in the first place, and skipped the Agility Bonus, the total Cost Level would have been only +13 (30w), and he would have saved 10w. Moral of the story: only take the extra Ability Bonus option if your relevant Ability is or will some day be 5 or greater.

Green Goblin: The cost for most of the Goblin's gear is taken straight from page 126. I assumed that the Gas Bombs are similar, in price, to the Pumpkin Bombs. I cut back his bombs to 6 of each type, as on that page, since 12 of each type seemed to be overkill and was, in any event, prohibitively expensive.

Hulk: The parenthetical values are for Bruce Banner's form (they get added into the final total). Hulk's Strength was bought as 18 (its maximum) but with two Disadvantages: 1) the score can only exceed 10 when he is enraged (-2), and 2) the score increases only relatively slowly when he is enraged (+1 per 3 Panels) but decreases all at once when he is calm (-2). Thus, the final cost was based on an effective score of 14, which seems about right. Technically, Hulk's transformation should have the Power Out of Control Disadvantage, but I could see no practical way to factor this in, since it would affect every single trait he gets. The so-called Transform Self Modifier is really just a method for buying traits in two different forms and has no cost of its own to modify. There could also be some debate as to which form the Disadvantage should apply to, anyway, since Banner does virtually all of his "adventuring" in Hulk form, and his Appearance Challenge and such are all based on this form, as well. Giving him a big cost break on all of his Hulk traits would, thus, be abusive and unbalancing. I would recommend treating his Uncontrolled Transformation as a Challenge, instead, worth only 3w, since, realistically, it helps him more often than it harms him (unless he reverts to Banner at an awkward moment). In fact, this would probably be a good idea for most characters of this sort, as the Disadvantage method is simply too awkward and unbalancing.

Human Torch: Since Johnny's Toughness only works when his flame is on, it was purchased with the same -1 reduction that applied to his Flight bought through Mastery of Fire.

Invisible Woman: Sue was granted the -1 cost break on Flight, since it "fits with her main power" (she uses force columns to move about).

Iron Man: The parenthetical values are for his Powered Armor. Note that the total cost for the suit's weapons and Modifiers is reduced by 8w to reflect Stark's Wealth, as usual (this is included, parenthetically, under Challenges). Most of Iron Man's weapons are described and valued on page 76 (note that he has two repulsor rays). His finger laser can defeat a Difficulty of about 7 but takes time to use and is of little value as a weapon (which would be redundant, anyway, given his many other weapons). With at least -5 levels in Disadvantages, it seemed to be worth little more than 2r, so I valued it as such.

Kang: The parenthetical values are for his Powered Armor. Note that the total cost for the suit's weapons and Modifiers is reduced by 10w to reflect Kang's Wealth, as usual (this is included, parenthetically, under Challenges). Kang's "exoskeleton" in probably a non-ability and simply justifies the physical attributes and defenses provided by his Powered Armor. His Time Ship could be considered a "normal" piece of equipment (i.e. one costing no stones), given his background. Personally, I would be inclined to charge him some stones for it, but, since it is poorly defined in the game, and no time-related powers exist, anyway, I'm really not sure how much it would cost. For this reason, I simply left it out of the equation. Naturally, this also applies to his Powered Armor's "useable with Time Ship" notation.

Kingpin: The cost for most of the Kingpin's gear is taken straight from page 126. The other resources listed under his "Equipment" can be treated as a function of his high Wealth score (8) and criminal background.

Loki: Loki's sword is enchanted and unusual enough to warrant the expenditure of stones. It was purchased with a Cost Level of Modifier + 2. How does one define "any element", for Force Blast, in cost terms? Well, I figured that once you can use about three extra elements, any more are pretty extraneous, so I considered it to be a +3 Advantage. Better question: how do you define a cost for "God-like Powers", especially when one of them is listed as "Healing, Magic, etc."? I finally settled on a Cost Level of Action Number + 10 - or 17 (50w), in Loki's case. This was based on the idea that most powers comprising it would normally have a cost of around Action Number + 2, but that some might be as high as +3 or +4. I settled on a base of +4 (a sensible value for the hypothetical best power in the group), then, following the Mastery of Elements and Telepathy pattern, added +1 for each extra option, assuming that there would be at least possible 6 options (and any more would probably be extraneous). This also puts the cost roughly on par with taking a value of 7 in Mastery of Magic, Sorcery, Summoning, and Witchcraft, which seems about right (i.e. 12w x 4 = 48w).

Magneto: The Magneto write-up on page 27 lists no Magnetic Force Blast, and, so, none was included in his cost, here. On the other hand, the write-up of his Mastery of Magnetism power, on page 55, includes a Magnetic Force Blast, so, if you want him to have that, add 5w to his Action cost (and, thus, to his total cost). Magneto was granted the -1 cost break on Flight, since it "fits with his main power" (he uses magnetic force to move about). The game value of Magneto's helmet has been left undefined in the book, but I treated it as Mental Defense +8 (adding to his already impressive Intelligence and personal Mental Defense combination). Purchased as part of his suit (-2) and only working against Telepathy (only -1, since there are few other powers it would need to work against), it has a total Cost Level of +5 (3w). The cost for the rest of his suit is taken straight from page 126.

Punisher: I assumed that Special Ops is similar in scope to Black Ops and valued it accordingly. It didn't seem kosher for the Green Goblin to have to pay stones for his bombs and give the Punisher his (which are much the same) for free, so I charged him a similar fee - specifically, 6w for the concussion grenades, plus 3w for each of the other two types. As noted, he has 6 of each type per mission. As usual, his guns cost no stones, only money.

Rogue: Rogue has a problem similar to that noted for the Hulk, above, i.e. her Steal Superpower Action should have the Power Out of Control Disadvantage, but there is no way to apply it. In this case, the problem arises from the fact that Steal Superpower has a set cost (30w), rather than one based on an Action Number. I could have turned it into a Challenge, but, given that it would probably be worth only around 3w (as an extreme example of "power dangerous to self" or "chronic condition"), that just didn't seem fair. This trick worked fine for the Hulk, since, from a purely practical point of view, he seldom suffers much for his Uncontrolled Transformation, anyway. Rogue, on the other hand, suffers continually from her power being always on and, on top of that, it generates annoying side effects (i.e. absorbed psyches) to the point that she is often discouraged from using it at all. It seemed like a -2 level Disadvantage, but how to apply it? I settled on "reverse engineering" the power's base cost to get a fair value. Since a cost of 30 would normally be linked to an Action Number of 13, I simply charged her for an Action Number of 11, i.e. 20w. A 10w discount is pretty big, but, given all of the problems the power has traditionally given her, it seems fair, especially when compared to other powers of a similar scope, with similar disadvantages.

Silver Surfer: Thank goodness they listed a cost for "The Power Cosmic", as I would have had no idea what to do with that! Just wish they had done the same for "God-like Powers"... The cost for the Surfer's board is taken straight from page 126.

Spider-Man: Okay, this is probably the biggest oversight in MURPG. What, exactly, do Spider-Man's web shooters do, in explicit game terms? The book contains no entangle-type Action or Modifier that they can be even remotely compared to, and their description, in Spidey's write-up, is pretty much useless. For obvious reasons, I had serious trouble trying to figure out a cost for them, although they should definitely have one. I finally settled on just charging for a Cost Level of 6, since that is the Modifier listed. It could easily be argued that an equivalent trait would have a value above Action Number +0, especially given the stunts Spidey does with the power (which might count as options that raise the price). However, since the power is in a device with "charges", anyway, that seems to cancel out such perks and make the base cost seem fair. Don't hold me to this, though, if they decide to eventually clean up Spidey's write-up and clarify the trait...

Storm: It could easily be argued that Storm's Mastery of Weather warrants a +1 "extraordinary power" modifier, although I did not include it, above, since the book makes to mention of it, in her case. If you think it should be applied, though, just add +5 to her Action cost (and, thus, to her total cost). This seems to bring her more in line with the other X-Men, anyway. Storm was granted the -1 cost break on Flight, since it "fits with her main power" (she glides on the winds she creates).

Thor: The parenthetical values are for his human form (they get added into the final total). I assumed that "Medical Skills" refers to "Healing, Medical" and valued the Action accordingly. No values have been given anywhere in the book for any of Thor's gear, so that left me in a bit of a quandary. I'm guessing that the Magic Belt is worth around 3w. Raising Thor's Strength from 10 to 12 would cost 10w, but the belt has some serious disadvantages: it is a device (half value, more or less), and it leaves him weakened much longer than it grants him strength (again, half value, more or less - rounding up). I'm guessing that the Magic Chariot is worth around 4w. Raising Thor's Speed from 5 to 10 would cost 12w, but I divided this by 3, because the chariot also has many drawbacks. It is a large, unwieldy device, used only "in times of need", and the Speed bonus it grants really only applies when trying to get "from A to B" quickly (which is just meant to move the story along, when all is said and done). Then there is Mjolnir... Frankly, I have no idea what the value of Thor's hammer would be, and MURPG doesn't give me any clues, so I just left it out of the equation. If forced to make a guess, I would think that it is worth at least 72w. This is based on the idea that feature #1 is worth around 3w, #2 is worth around 2w, #3 and #4 are covered under #6, #5 has already been paid for through Transform Self, and #6 is worth around 67w, in total. This is really just a guess, but, since it brings Thor's total to 180w (which seems much more accurate than the 108w, listed above), it probably isn't far off.

Toad: Although it is listed as a Modifier, Toad's slime was purchased as a +2 Advantage for Tongue Whip, so its cost is included under Actions (along with the +1 Weapon Modifier Advantage). Of course, the real question, though, is why Toad doesn't have some Action to represent his leaping ability...

Ultron: As noted on page 75, a Tractor Beam basically counts as Telekinesis, for cost purposes. The Encephalo-Beam is, of course, Telepathy, usable with Intelligence ("Reprogramming, Subliminal Commands" replaces "Control Others" and "Can Affect Computer AI" is treated as an extra +1 option, so the total Cost Level = Action Number + 6). The "Adamantium" notation, under Toughness, I translated to mean that he has the equivalent of an Adamantium Skeleton (3w). The Poverty Challenge is based on the fact that the book lists Ultron's Wealth as -1 (representing a lack of income, I presume). Given that he always seems to have the equipment he needs, you may wish to remove this Challenge. As per the rules on page 78 (and as implied by the character's own write-up), I built Ultron as a robot to get the costs, listed above. Frankly, however, I think this is abusive in the extreme. Since Ultron's Abilities, Actions, and Modifiers are part of him and cannot be taken away without damaging him, why should he get a huge cost break? Personally, I think he should just be built as a normal character, in which case, his values would be as follows: Abilities 27w + Actions 97w 2r + Modifiers 51w - Challenges 13w = Total 162w 2r. This total seems much more reflective of Ultron's power level and place in the Marvel universe than 117w.

Venom: See the note for Spider-Man, above, concerning the Web Shooters. Venom's Stealth Modifier is so specific that I couldn't see charging more than 1W. His reduced Prescience Modifier seems to be worth around 4w.

Wasp: Her antennae are awfully specific, but she has, traditionally, found the occasional good use for them, and they are retractable, so I figured they are worth around 2w.

Wolverine: Note that Armor Penetration is, technically, a Close Combat Advantage and, thus, has been included under the Action cost, rather than the Modifier cost.

Yellowjacket: The cost for Yellowjacket's armor is taken straight from page 126 (3w), although 2r must be added to it for Flight 3 (purchased as per Powered Armor). The cybernetic helmet is similar to Wasp's antennae (see above) but, since it is a device, I reduced the cost to 1w.


Fini!

[Cwylric]

Okay, skip my comment about writing to me to get a neat, clean copy of the cost breakdown chart. I just uploaded it to the files section of MURPGList, so anyone can get their own copy now. Should have thought of that sooner... doh!

Check out:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MURPGList/files/

[WYLDKARDE]

OK, I FINALLY got it and the X-Men sourcebook too. From the playtesting I have done, YES Cyclops is BROKEN.:(

I'm gonna go back and try a few more characters (we are kinda playing around, no roleplaying, just brawling) but I do believe overall, this game has promise.

As a side note, ONE thing I miss from the old days on the RPG days, and even the old Marvel RPG is that they gave you a map that you could pull out, didn't have to blow up any pics from a page or anything, you just got the map.
ah well.

[Cwylric]

Originally posted by WYLDKARDE
OK, I FINALLY got it and the X-Men sourcebook too. From the playtesting I have done, YES Cyclops is BROKEN.:(

There are a couple of possible fixes that help somewhat. First, give him Targeting +3. It makes sense, and it helps with his Energy problem. Second, either increase his Durability to 4 or give him Healing Factor, with the Disadvantage that it only regenerates Energy, not Health (this was actually Evan's suggestion). Personally, I prefer the second option, because it simulates his ability to absorb solar energy (or, in some versions of his character, cosmic energy) to fuel his power. Besides, I don't really think Cyke has a 4 Health.

Oh, and I noticed that Evan is thinking about adding Area Effect to Cyke's Optic Blast, in his most powerful incarnation. That would definitely beef him up!

[Cwylric]

Just a quick note to say that the .doc and .pdf files that contain the costs breakdowns for the 42 characters in the MURPG book have been updated. Check out:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MURPGList/files/

The changes are quite minor. I just fixed a couple of typos and changed the cost of "2x Natural Healing Rate" to 2r (knocking the totals for Beast and Cap down to 54w and 66w2r, respectively). I was going to put this off for a while to see if any more changes needed to be made, but a number of people have asked me to repost the documents elsewhere, so I thought I'd better clean them up now.

[Cwylric]

I found a small oversight in the Notes section of the character cost breakdowns article I posted earlier. Add:

Jean Grey: I am not sure whether her +7 Mental Defense, listed under Modifiers, represents the free bonus she gets for Telepathy or a separate perk altogether (giving her a total of +14). On one hand, both have a value of 7, so it could be the former; on the other hand, free Modifiers aren't always listed for characters, so it could be the latter. On the chart, I assumed it was separate and, thus, charged her for it. If you would prefer the opposite approach and assume that the Modifier is just the freebie she gets from Telepathy, then reduce her Modifier cost (and, thus, her Total cost) by 6w.

[Cwylric]

Well, my MURPG notions have now gone firmly from the mostly theoretical to the practical.

We just had a monster MURPG fest, that lasted all weekend, off and on. A few days ago, we ran the InQuest adventure, using the supplied characters, just to make sure everyone fully understood the system. Then, I ran two adventures (the one in the book, plus one of my own) over the last couple of days, with each player using his or her own character, rather than an existing one (they are a bunch of mutants that are starting to become affiliated with the X-Men -- no group name, yet, although they were jokingly referring to themselves as the Xtras). It was definitely fun, although it also resulted in a number of long discussions about the way the game handles (or doesn't handle) some powers. The latter led to another couple of hour session, simulating "real" comic battles (I'll get into that later). In this post, I will summarize our impressions.


THE GOOD...

The core Action Resolution System is neat. It is both fun and functional, and it genuinely encourages players (and GMs) to think about tactics, beyond simply bashing a foe senseless, turn after turn. Bravo! The only bad thing about it is that keeping track of stones for a multitude of villains can be a royal pain for the GM (the players loved it, but they had only a single character, each, to keep track of). Mainly, it is just a problem of limited space, at a typical gaming table. We found that the easiest way to avoid this problem was to skip the stones for GM characters (physically, I mean) and just jot down what they were doing with their "imaginary" stones on a scrap sheet of paper. This method lacked the tactile pleasure of tossing stones around, but it sure took up a lot less room.

The Panel and Page method of sequencing is clever and very appropriate for the genre. It encourages the mood by making players think in comic terms. Thumbs up!

The Lines of Experience reward system is a neat idea that seems to work very well, in practice. Obviously, none of our characters have gotten enough Lines to improve anything, yet, at this early stage, but it is easy to see where they are starting to go and how they may get there. I have complete confidence in this system and am already starting to consider how it could be worked into other games. There is no bad here.


...THE BAD...

As I mentioned earlier, the ARS is cool, and the basic idea of the way Energy is used as a resource is fine. However, the scale seems screwed up. Everybody keeps hedging around this on the forums, but let's just come out and say it, once and for all:

Characters tire out much too easily.

Yes, people like Wolverine should have an edge in durability, over the long haul, but that edge should not kick in after only one Panel. Not only does it ruin the authenticity that the rest of the system handles so well, but, even worse, it is simply *not fun* for many sorts of characters who have true "superpower" Actions that "burn out" after only a Panel or two.

It should not be necessary for every new PC created to have Drain Energy, Energy Absorption, or a Durability of 5+, just to stay in the game. Nor should characters be able to minimax so thoroughly by focusing on Modifiers, instead of Actions. This dangerous trend could really screw up the game's long-term viability and the uniqueness of its resource management system, if people start turning Actions into Modifiers on a regular basis (which is *very* tempting).

We even went so far as to test this out, by grabbing up some comics and simulating the actual battles that occurred in them, for a couple of hours (which was both fun and informative, BTW). The good news is that the system *mostly* handled it very well. The bad news is that the Energy end of things was a total *mess*. Even factoring in the occasional "rest Panel" (that did not occur in the comics), the characters tired out at least twice as fast as they should. Again, this game simulates the genre very effectively in most respects; shouldn't it do so here, as well?


...AND THE UGLY.

The rules are sparse and far too vague in too many areas. The designers seem proud that they kept the page count down to 128. Frankly, I wouldn't be. The pages should probably have been better spent or there should have been more of them.

The core ARS is well documented and presents few problems, but many of the Actions are poorly described, and some seem to be broken. (Regular readers will already know about my pet peeves: Energy Absorption, ranged Drain Energy's free "auto hit" feature, Spider-Man's web shooters and the lack of a general entangle power, etc.) There are lots of Action examples, but far too many of them cause more confusion than clarity, by avoiding unusual situations (which would answer some questions) and, in some cases, by actually appearing to contradict the main text.

As experienced gamers, we managed to sort things out, for the most part (although not without some *long* discussions and a lot of posts on the forums), but newbies may find themselves lost, once they start actually trying to play the game (read pages 1 and 2 of the book, again, and you will see the unpleasant irony here). This is compounded by the fact that the game initially *reads* well and fools you with the simplicity of the ARS, but the problems all start to pile up when you actually try to *play* it. I think this is reflected in the notes I have seen on various forums. Everybody starts off saying "this game rocks!" but, once they start making characters and actually playing, they are soon saying, "uhm... I don't understand X.... how does Y work? ... am I really reading this right?!?... etc."

QED really needs to work on this. I suspect a 2nd edition may end up being necessary, but, at the very least, they need to put together a *solid* and easily accessible FAQ and errata. In a nutshell, as one of my players put it: "The books reads like a draft, not a final copy".


CONCLUSIONS

With regard to all of the above problems, I have to confess to being a bit puzzled by the long list of playtesters on page 123. Didn't they catch some of this stuff? My guess is that most of them had the game explained to them by the designers and, thus, never had to sort through the actual rules, themselves. If they had been forced to rely on the book, alone, I suspect that they would have noticed some of the more obvious gaps (at least) and/or would have each ended up playing their own version of the game, since they would have had to make up a lot of rules on the spot. That's okay for regular gaming, with experienced players, but not at all useful when play*testing* a manuscript (or when playing with newbies, for that matter).

As far as the Energy problem is concerned, at least it is easy to fix. We are considering having Energy = 6 x Durability, instead of 3x. This will give each character twice as much juice, which is what seemed to be needed in our test runs. The proportions between short-, medium-, and long-winded characters will be preserved, but everyone will have more options for the first few panels. It will also reduce the "trump effect" of energy draining powers, at least a little. We are also going to add in some sort of Power Battery Modifier, as I described in an earlier post, but that won't affect most characters.

I'm in the process of going over some of the questions I asked Evan and combining the resulting clarifications with some house rules that we are thinking about incorporating (mostly additions, rather than changes). Once I get it all sorted out, I'll probably post the results here. If anyone is really interested, I might even post the stats for the PCs who form our core group. Stay tuned...

[CannonballFan]

Once again, great insight. Though I haven't really played much of the game myself yet, I've seen most of the things you are pointing out. The one statement that you made that really strikes home for me is

"The books reads like a draft, not a final copy"

This is my opinion for the whole game. IMO, despite what pages 1 & 2 state, this game is NOT for novice RPGers. I'm not as hard core as many gamers out there, but I've been playing off and on for the last 15 years and I had a hard time with a lot of the stuff in the book.

Again, I think this is a good game, it really is. BUT 1.5 or second addition will kick @$$. They've laid a foundation, they just need to build on it.

[Eric J. Moreels]

Folks, this thread is intended for discussion of the contents of the feature article. Please move general discussion on the game, links to related sites, etc to the Rec Room (http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=42) forum here @ X-Fan.

Thanks!

[Cwylric]

Originally posted by Eric J. Moreels
Folks, this thread is intended for discussion of the contents of the feature article. Please move general discussion on the game, links to related sites, etc to the Rec Room (http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&amp;forumid=42) forum here @ X-Fan.

Thanks!

No prob. I imagine this section is going to completely dry up, then, though...

Hmmm... I just took a peek in the Rec Room section and the only related area I could find was here:
http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/forums/showthread.php?threadid=18740

So far, it only has two posts, and they're both old. Don't think I'll bother getting too entrenched, there, as I'm involved in too many other forums already. So if you want to find me, check out:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/marveluniverseroleplayinggame/

or

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MURPGList/

(More often the first one.)

[Cwylric]

Originally posted by katori15
Cwylric My question is if I do not look at the game as a &quot;Marvel Universe&quot; game how is it? I saw that there are MANY problems with the comic to character transfer. I think that has alot to do with the Marvel Universe itself.
Is there a chance to add alittle more random factor? I think having some of the stones be coins. This adds some but, not the over powering d20.
Is the time frame to hard to keep track of?
[/color]

I'll just answer this one quick, to tie off loose ends, before heading out of here (note Eric's message). I'm not sure what to say, beyond what I've already said in this forum, but I'll give it a go. Addressing the above questions, in order:

Personally, I think a lot of the fun of the game is the Marvel connection; however, it is definitely not essential. In fact, one of the groups I was chatting with used it to play with DC characters that they made, and everything worked fine. The system is quite neat, in principal -- they just need to work out some of the details. Again, see my "mini-review" post.

You could add a random factor, but I think that would kind of defeat the purpose. Part of the charm of the system is its resource management core.

Keeping track of the time frame is a snap. If you can think in terms of comic panels, you will have no problem at all. Most of the time, it isn't really that different from rounds or turns in other RPGs, anway.

If you're really curious about the game but don't want to fork out the big bucks, check out InQuest, issue #96 (April). It has a really generous demo of the game, which contains at least half the core book. Or check out the sample pages here:

http://www.marvel.com/murpg/

[Eric J. Moreels]

Originally posted by Cwylric
No prob. I imagine this section is going to completely dry up, then, though...

Well that's why we have a games forum, for more general discussion on games ;) It just helps make things easier for new visitors to keep discussion in this forum on the topic of each feature, and keep general discussion on games in the Rec Room.

So far, it only has two posts, and they're both old. Don't think I'll bother getting too entrenched, there, as I'm involved in too many other forums already.

Looks like that thread's picked up somewhat. :)

[katori15]

Eric J. Moreels could you please add a link to the other forum page in the first post. other forum link (http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/forums/showthread.php?threadid=18740) I think people may have easier time finding it. I will delete this post after. It would be big help. Thank you Eric.

[the_reaver]

Nightcrawler-0, drop me a line about the "no-collar" club.

[tomasina]

http://ozbot.typepad.com/spideyguide/

As players of MURPG we all face the problem of trying to find new material, clarifications, rules, etc., for a game which is no longer officially supported or produced. Since there is no official support for the game, any improvements or additions must be supplied by the players themselves. Coordinating the development of these improvements or additions is such a daunting task that while many have mentioned the desire to continue development of MURPG materials on a player-based model… few have actually succeeded. Well, we are about to change all that.

We have all heard of the Spider-Man’s Guide to New York which was announced by Marvel but never completed due to the termination of the MURPG project. We have all read the numerous posts of players trying to find out where to access the content of this book which held all the materials for one of the genres most popular characters. Well thanks to a great management team, and the help of numerous players and fans, we are proud to announce that this content, which has long been thought lost for good, is soon going to be available to the MURPG world.

Clint Freeman, Danny Wall, Gary Timmons, Mike Cmero Jr., and everyone else involved is proud to announce that the Unofficial Spider-Man Roster Book for the Marvel Universe Role-playing Game is nearing completion and will soon be available in .PDF format for all to use and benefit from. The Unofficial Spider-Man Roster Book will include over 40 profiles of Spider-Man's allies and enemies, new Actions and Modifiers, a full-length adventure with maps, and a number of other features, including a section called the "Adventure Generator", a feature that was intended to appear in the original Spider-Man's Guide to New York.

To help the fans and players of the MURPG become familiar with this project a website has been created to publish project updates, previews (such as cover shots, maps, and profiles), and methods of feedback to those who are developing and managing this project. This site can be accessed at http://ozbot.typepad.com/spideyguide/ and is your best source of information regarding this continuing project.

In addition to the site above, you can provide feedback regarding this project, or simply ask any questions you might have, by emailing tomsalm@gmail.com. All feedback and suggestions are welcome and encouraged.

We look forward to your visit to our site, and are working as hard as possible to get this desired material to all of you as soon as possible!

- The “Unofficial Spider-Man Roster Book” Development Team

http://ozbot.typepad.com/spideyguide/